And, frankly, I don’t care all that much if the era is tainted. I enjoyed baseball then and I enjoy it now. I certainly would prefer that players did not take dangerous drugs to improve their performance but I can’t understand this feeling of betrayal that people seem to feel.

It sounds like someone is taking PEDs for enjoyment. Someone stop this man before he actually cracks a grin and cheers for the sport he loves! Think of the attendance records that may be broken!!!

Should we put an asterisk next to fan enjoyment and revenues too?

As I said, I think Clemens deserves to be in the HoF, because he was ONE of the best pitchers of his era, an era that was thoroughly infiltrated with performance-enhancing substances. I don’t want to see anyone measuring his numbers up against Warren Spahn, Bob Gibson, or even Nolan Ryan though, and unless you’re claiming that Greg Maddux’s 82 mph fastball is steroid-aided then I don’t want to see anyone putting Roger ahead of him either.

This is what really kills me.

Have you looked at the power numbers of many of the hitters who have actually been caught using steroids? There is absolutely no reason to believe that the person needs to be big/strong/throw hard to use steroids.

What if Maddux used steroids to maintain an 82 mph fastball rather than a 72 mph one? Why does it somehow mean more when it’s 98 to 88?

Baseball has never been clean. Steroids is just the most recent way to cheat.

Why does everyone act as if this era is somehow special in that respect? Have you just ignored the history of the game, or are you caught up in the ‘witch hunt’ as Mr. Schneider put it?

in the report it also states that clemens asked mcnamee about Anadrol-50. Now my question is, why didn’t he ask the same questions about winstrol? Does it make sense to you that he will ask mcnamee about one steroid, but not the other? From the looks of it, clemens didn’t need to ask about winstrol because he was using it before and knew the benefits they provided.

Second, JC says “walks are not the thing I think of when I think of performance gains from steroids,” but what can their possibly be to gain from steroids if it isn’t increased velocity and an ability to challenge hitters? Note two important words (since this IS a rational argument, the words are important): “could” and “and.” I felt it necessary to point out the counter-argument, and avoid an error by omission, but I certainly am not claiming to have proven my case, so I used the word “could.” I used the term HGH AND steroids, because I believe that Clemens probably used them both, and at least some part of the cocktail helped to increase velocity, as well as maintain strong muscles/ligaments/tendons to allow him to pitch more frequently and for longer times.

The last 2+ decades of baseball have fallen under a cloud, and we simply can’t ignore this. I’m not out to pillory the man, or to put any asterisks in the record book, but I am out to show people that this era is as different from the ’40s, as the ’40s were different from the dead ball era. As I said, I think Clemens deserves to be in the HoF, because he was ONE of the best pitchers of his era, an era that was thoroughly infiltrated with performance-enhancing substances. I don’t want to see anyone measuring his numbers up against Warren Spahn, Bob Gibson, or even Nolan Ryan though, and unless you’re claiming that Greg Maddux’s 82 mph fastball is steroid-aided then I don’t want to see anyone putting Roger ahead of him either.

And to JC: Thank you for your blog, I do respect your work a great deal, but I also know you expect more from your readers than to nod and agree with everything you posit.

You probably should have just stopped right there. It’s pretty clear your arguments are motivated more by personal bias to the situation than rational argument. To call someone who has done extensive research and discussion on the topic naive because he does not agree with your gut instinct is pretty childish.

In the only portion of your post where you discuss anything he actually wrote, you talk of J.C. presuming too much in his discussion of walks and strikeouts since HGH and steroids “could certainly lead to increased velocity, which would allow an aging pitcher to continue peppering the strike zone…”. Although steroids would seemingly enhance performance, you assume that HGH does the same when the scientific literature does little to back you up on that. Truth is, HGH hasn’t been shown to increase baseball performance. On the other hand excellent fitness and nutrition, something Clemens is known to promote, would likely play a role in a pitchers health and ability. Who is to say that his workout regiments aren’t to blame for his performance spike? Following this, you argue a specific pitching style and scenario in which it would be feasible to explain Clemens’ numbers in the context of increased velocity from steroids and HGH. All that you’ve logically proved from that statement is that it is physically possible for you to be correct. J.C. never argued otherwise for that.

While I personally feel that Roger Clemens is guilty, it is not an open and shut case. If you are going to assume he is guilty and leave it at that then it is probably a waste of time to argue why it makes sense to be skeptical on the situation as a whole. But even you can understand the value in taking a look at the available evidence and making an objective decision on the issue. J.C. did just that.

I can’t believe the naivety of that statement. As unfortunate as it is, I find it hard to put a presumption of innocence on ANYONE involved in baseball over the last 2+ decades, certainly not when there are so many questionable characteristics involved. (For me the bat throwing incident with Piazza seals the deal, that clearly was not a human being acting naturally.)

Your discussion of BBs and Ks also presumes too much. HGH and steroids could certainly lead to increased velocity, which would allow an aging pitcher to continue peppering the strike zone, rather than make adjustments. This would certainly lead to fewer walks, and arguably fewer Ks as opposing batters would be able to sit on the heat, which leads to more contact, even if not the most productive contact.

Does any of this mean he shouldn’t be in the Hall of Fame? Probably not, but it certainly means people should stop trumpeting him as the best pitcher ever, he’s a thrower. He is clearly surpassed by Maddux within his era, and probably a dozen pitchers from the past.